FMJ or Hollow Point…What Does It Matter?
The Ammo May Determine The Outcome
As I have been reading lately concerning the reasons for concealed carry and since I got my wife a gun for valentine’s day…which of course completed my certification as a redneck, I was pondering what kind of ammo she could carry.
Unfortunately I now realize that .380 ammo is more expensive than the 9mm ammo. Bummer.
I found out that the reason is because they use the same machines to make the .380 as the 9mm…so…they have to stop production of the 9mm in order to make the .380. or so the story goes.
That brought me to another article I read a bit ago…about the penetration of bullets into targets. The science of ballistics is simple amazing. The more I learn, the more I realize I don’t know much at all. I once met a guy who was writing a book about terminal ballistics. The movement of the bullet once it has struck something. Very interesting. You don’t meet many people who have actually done the math for this sort of thing…and he has done it all, I was quite amazed.
It seems that we are all taught that hollow points are the only way to go as far as knock down power is concerned.
We are bullied about being tough and making sure the target is down and “ain’t gettin up” for sure….well guess what folks???
Here is the truth behind the marketing…
While hollow points do what they say they do…most of the time…there are some factors to consider.
1. What is the caliber?
2. What kind of hollow point do I want?
3. How many rounds does my gun carry?
4. Should I use both hollow points and FMJ’s in my magazine?
5. Can I get a hollow point with the rubber or plastic tips for distance, and how does that effect the penetration?
Lets take a look shall we…
Most of us do not think about what the ammo manufacturers do when they experiment with the different types of loads. When we are considering that there are many things that can play into a target going down, we need to think about the effects of our rounds on the target and target environment.
Like: The smaller the caliber…the less potential for penetration through shirts, coats, jackets, vests, backpacks, etc…
Who makes the best hollow point and why?
What about hydroshocks?
Is 7 or 8 rounds enough?
What about a mix of types?
Here is what I think….and what I have read about it.
I have not done gobbs of research about the effectiveness of the many brands of hollowpoints out there. The general rule is that you get what you pay for. I personally use hydroshocks because my mentor and the guy at the store said they were good. I am in them about $1.20 a round. Not too bad..but not cheap either. The technology is more advance now, so I’ll shoot out the old stuff and put in newer rounds soon enough. There are better brands and the cost is there as well.
BUT…for my wife, who now has a .380 the question stands, “FMJ or Hollowpoints?”
I have decided that since it is a little bit smaller round and since single stack pistols carry less rounds…that she should carry the FMJ’s, and she agrees…but she also doesn’t know, so she is trusting me on this one:)
If she is ever in a bad situation…I want the bullet to get into the target for sure. A few of those and she should be able to get away to safety…(fingers crossed) and then the attacker can bleed out and ponder his/her actions.
What I don’t want to happen is the hollow points to be stopped by an excess amount of clothes or something…like a bat or metal piece or something…(who knows what an attacker will have on them)
So I am reasoning that the Full Metal Jacket will be a better caliber for her carry pistol…since its a little smaller caliber that is.
I carry hollow points in my 9mm because its a heavier and bigger round…so according to the experts…I should be ok.
So go do the research and decide what is best…and then you have to find out how much you want to spend…and how long the rounds will last as well. (keep cool and dry and they should be long lasting)
Mixing rounds???? Well it would seem that such a question is pretty high tech really….I can only imagine that if the target didn’t go down in the first few shots…one would just keep shooting…but who knows what the situation would be really.
Maybe going for the hollow point for the first 3 rounds and then if no more shooting is needed…you are good to run..or perhaps following up the hollow points with some FMJ’s for added assurance is a good suggestion…????
That is a hard question to answer…but hopefully it will get yall thinking about the details. Most people just load the gun with one or the other…and that is probably ok too…but for my wife…I certainly had to think about it for her safety and to be a responsible, loving husband of course.
Smaller rounds…think about the FMJ’s as your carry ammo…
Bigger rounds…probably use the hollow points like you are doing anyway, and hope the guy isn’t on crack or something worse.
Yall Be Good,
From one Sheepdog to another.
Damon Thueson
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Have recently thought about what you mentioned above, 3+ rounds of hp followed by a stack of fmj. At first, I thought this was a great idea. Then I thought about the law aspect and came to this decision. The right prosecutor might get the right jury to view this as a pre-meditated decision to continue a fight beyond merely stopping an attacker. You and I may agree that this would be bs but once our lives are in the hands of 12 people that will definitely not be my peers….do I want the rest of my life based on how I loaded my magazine? No, I do not.
With that being said, I agree with the decision to load your wife with fmj. Less jamming potential and preferable penetration. Well done!
Tony…
That could certainly be the case. That is why I have an excellant attorney on my phone. In the same regard…there have been MANY instances where multiple rounds have hit a target and that target still endangers people. Getting a lawyer with good research abilities will take any argument out of the way. There isn’t any regulated “amount” of rounds that will stop an attacker…nothing defined there at all…so the gray area is huge. Again… that is where a good attorney comes into play. It is sad that such situations are even viable…but that is the world we live in. Thanks tons for the comment Tony…look forward to reading more from you!!
I would agree the fmj ether in a 40 or above caliber would be best for self defense or in a combat situation but lets stop and think for a second. We live in a world where all to often the criminals have more rights then we do or it would seem that’s the way it is. I was in the army infantry for 4 years and a tour in Iraq and now i work security and i carry a Springfield XDM in a 40cal. I just wanted to say that to give a back ground so you all know i know what i am talking about. First off the thing to look at is what am i going to primarily use this weapon for, then choose your caliber. I carry and like the 40 because you get the best of both worlds. You have the accuracy of the 9 with the stopping power of the 45 with the right round in it. Now back to the world we live in unless you hit something solid when your trying to stop some one you run the risk of over penetration and getting a through and through. Once that round leaves your weapon you are responsible for it until it stops. If you hit some one because you get a through and through you will be held liable for it and could face charges. My advice is to carry a round that is both a fmj and a jhp. You ask how is that? We have come a long way in the way rounds are manufactured now. To get a round like i said is what is called a core bonded jhp. They hit like a fmj but do the job like a jhp . I carry the Winchester core bonded PDX-1 they are very reliable and do exactly as they say. So i recommend these and any core bonded round. Happy hunting. Any questions i am on face book matt La.Rocque hope that has helped.
Matt, great stuff brother. I agree, the technology of the ammo is simply amazing! I have even started packing my little Ruger SR22 at times, using the CCI MiniMag. WOW, what a sweet little hunk of metal and Plastic…hahahaha
I may have to update that post and include some of the stuff they are coming out with now… or just let guys like you update me with comments and stuff…hahahaha I love the PDX series, my father in law uses those in his Taurus Judge, in the 410 shell… what a cool deal the PDX series is. Thanks for commenting and my facebook page is: Defense Actions…check us out!
Jacketed Hollowpoints all the way. Total energy transfer and safer for people/objects who not the intended target.
I would not recommend any plastic or rubber tipped hollowpoints however, they do not effect flight in any positive way. They may actually throw the rounds off.
I believe hollow points are plenty accurate, and they generate a vortex that keeps them as accurate, if not MORE accurate, than FMJ.
Great post and comments. Generally speaking, any caliber 9mm Short (aka .380 aka 9×17) and up is adequate for self defense. In addition, as a concealed carry holder, I need to be concerned about collateral damage. That eliminates FMJ from my carry weapon. PERIOD. In the rare occasion you get all your shots on target, there’s the possibility of a past-through and hitting a bystander behind your assailant. An even greater liability is ricochet. You might stop your attacker, but end up in prison for the mother of two you took out in the process. So then what HP do we choose? Several manufactures make defense loads that minimize the impact heavy clothing may have on a HP. Hornady’s Critical Defense is my personal choice, though Corbon and Speer also make excellent products. Regardless, may sure it cycles reliably through your firearm with ZERO failures of any kind.
Lets be honest, we’re not all Jason Bourne. The ability to put 3+ quick shots on target is limited by our competency to handle that particular sidearm AND it’s recoil. THAT is the factor by which you choose your gun/caliber. What are YOU best with. A .40 is stout. Law enforcement professionals struggle to put 3+ shots on target when it matters, and their sidearm is hardly concealable for most of us. IMHO a .40 cal firearm should NEVER be carried by the average joe. 9mm Luger is more than capable, but in a smaller conceal carry weapon it too may be too much for follow up shots by those with smaller builds. Why am I talking about follow up shots and not the one-stop-shot and “stopping power”? Because they are myths. Unless you’re hitting a vital organ dead on, there is relatively little difference between a .380 or a .45 for the 5-10 seconds you’re in this situation. What’s more important is how many tries you can get in 5-10 seconds to increase your odds of hitting that sweet spot. For most, that’s a 9mm Luger, .380, or lets not forget .38 special. (All 9mm btw). I’m 6’2″ at 170lbs. In order to carry concealed I use a Polish P64 in 9mm Makarov. Better guns out there? Of course, but *I* prefer that one over the others I’ve tried.
Lastly, while I wouldn’t carry or recommend them for personal defense, calibers .32 and smaller should never be HP. You just won’t get enough penetration. If you insist on carrying one, you must have FMJ and adhere to the “spray and pray” tactic of emptying your clip into the assailant’s head/neck/upper chest, throwing your gun at them, and then running away.
Sorry for my soapbox.
Oh and I’m sorry. One last comment. While I love CCI Minimags in my rifle, any of the “hyper” velocity .22LR rounds are useless in most non-target pistols. To achieve a greater velocity over their .22LR standard brethren, they use a slower burning powder. In the long barrel of rifles they’re awesome rounds. Pistols however don’t have the barrel length to burn all that powder before the bullet exits the muzzle, resulting in similar velocities as standard rounds and a pronounced muzzle flash likely to blind you more than your attacker. Ok, seriously off my soapbox this time!
All my best!